Mackenzie Lueck ////// 318

25 comments

  • Alison

    Alison Philadelphia, PA

    I think it's pretty important to detail that Mackenzie lived a rather riskier life than some. In no way am I saying that means she deserves this horrible act but it does show that if you live a certain lifestyle you might find yourself in situations that you wouldn't be in had you not lived this way. It could be a lesson for others. Mackenzie was involved in a sugar baby lifestyle and posted about this and tips in sugar baby groups and forums. For some reason that is being ignored in our media outlets but not in others, and this is a fact. She was not just some girl who casually met someone in the park... there is a risk factor in this lifestyle. I am terribly sorry for her, her family and friends for this terrible tragedy but it is important to report all of the facts. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7185285/amp/Missing-University-Utah-student-Mackenzie-Lueck-sugar-baby-sought-men-35.html

    I think it's pretty important to detail that Mackenzie lived a rather riskier life than some. In no way am I saying that means she deserves this horrible act but it does show that if you live a certain lifestyle you might find yourself in situations that you wouldn't be in had you not lived this way. It could be a lesson for others. Mackenzie was involved in a sugar baby lifestyle and posted about this and tips in sugar baby groups and forums. For some reason that is being ignored in our media outlets but not in others, and this is a fact. She was not just some girl who casually met someone in the park... there is a risk factor in this lifestyle. I am terribly sorry for her, her family and friends for this terrible tragedy but it is important to report all of the facts. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7185285/amp/Missing-University-Utah-student-Mackenzie-Lueck-sugar-baby-sought-men-35.html

  • amy adams

    amy adams global

    Nick I want to write a comment that isn't judgemental but I can't today. You really need to stop saying stuff like 'She was a good girl' Mackenzie was a WOMAN, a young woman - NOT a 'girl.' I love your program but please stop with the sexist remarks. Your audience doesn't say about you 'Nick you're a good boy' because it's wrong. I hope you understand why it's wrong to refer to women as girls. The captain at least called her a 'young lady.'

    Nick I want to write a comment that isn't judgemental but I can't today. You really need to stop saying stuff like 'She was a good girl'

    Mackenzie was a WOMAN, a young woman - NOT a 'girl.' I love your program but please stop with the sexist remarks. Your audience doesn't say about you 'Nick you're a good boy' because it's wrong. I hope you understand why it's wrong to refer to women as girls. The captain at least called her a 'young lady.'

  • Anon

    Anon Pennsylvania

    Amy Adams, you're an idiot. He doesn't "really need to stop" anything, how about if you don't like it, don't listen to it. People like you ruin everything. And yes, this is coming from a FEMALE since you're so obsessed with gender. Searching for things to be offended over...what a bitter and miserable existence.

    Amy Adams, you're an idiot. He doesn't "really need to stop" anything, how about if you don't like it, don't listen to it. People like you ruin everything. And yes, this is coming from a FEMALE since you're so obsessed with gender. Searching for things to be offended over...what a bitter and miserable existence.

  • True Crime Garage

    True Crime Garage

    It’s all good... I think there should be no real issue here. In my neck of the woods common terms are college girl or college boy and these are meant with zero disrespect and actually often with a good deal of respect. The Captain and I speak for 2 to 3 hours on mic a week - it would be incredibly tedious to police each and every word, phrase and so on. I meant the use of good girl with respect. Also I am 16 years older than Mackenzie - I have nieces her same age. I’m not sexist, just old and old enough to refer to both genders as college kids. Cheers Nic

    It’s all good...
    I think there should be no real issue here. In my neck of the woods common terms are college girl or college boy and these are meant with zero disrespect and actually often with a good deal of respect. The Captain and I speak for 2 to 3 hours on mic a week - it would be incredibly tedious to police each and every word, phrase and so on. I meant the use of good girl with respect. Also I am 16 years older than Mackenzie - I have nieces her same age. I’m not sexist, just old and old enough to refer to both genders as college kids.
    Cheers Nic

  • Nicholas

    Nicholas Missouri

    I just wanted to thank the Captain for his comments regarding the high risk behavior this poor girl engaged in. The internet is an odd place. If you mention that a crime victim may have made some bad choices, you are immediately assailed by ten posters claiming you are "blaming the victim." Obviously, no one deserves to be murdered. But it's idiotic not consider that one can place one's self in a position where bad things are more possible, and it should be the case that people can learn from these issues. To shut down this conversation does a disservice to everyone, including the victim, whose horrific experiences may ultimately benefit another innocent person. I have a teenage daughter, and I would be extremely frightened for her if she was meeting some character from the Internet that she doesn't know in the wee hours of the morning at a park.

    I just wanted to thank the Captain for his comments regarding the high risk behavior this poor girl engaged in. The internet is an odd place. If you mention that a crime victim may have made some bad choices, you are immediately assailed by ten posters claiming you are "blaming the victim." Obviously, no one deserves to be murdered. But it's idiotic not consider that one can place one's self in a position where bad things are more possible, and it should be the case that people can learn from these issues. To shut down this conversation does a disservice to everyone, including the victim, whose horrific experiences may ultimately benefit another innocent person. I have a teenage daughter, and I would be extremely frightened for her if she was meeting some character from the Internet that she doesn't know in the wee hours of the morning at a park.

  • Leslie

    Leslie Delaware

    Yes, Amy Adams, you are an idiot. It’s a colloquialism, not a put down. Go away. Leave these hard working podcast guys alone. Moron.

    Yes, Amy Adams, you are an idiot. It’s a colloquialism, not a put down. Go away. Leave these hard working podcast guys alone. Moron.

  • Cathy

    Cathy Parts unknown

    I love you guys so I was excited to see this case pop up in my feed yesterday. I've seen her case in my news feed for awhile and listened to another podcast that is a bit lighter in nature, but still true crime, about it on july 5th. I thought you guys would have more details because I've always thought you did great research on your cases. However, I was very disappointed that the website Seeking Arrangement wasn't mentioned at all, as that is the suspicion of how she met the guy. She was heavily involved in the sugar baby/daddy lifestyle from everything I've heard, even though she was raised Mormon. Also, the other podcast mentioned a mattress that a-hole got rid of that had blood stains on it.

    I love you guys so I was excited to see this case pop up in my feed yesterday. I've seen her case in my news feed for awhile and listened to another podcast that is a bit lighter in nature, but still true crime, about it on july 5th. I thought you guys would have more details because I've always thought you did great research on your cases. However, I was very disappointed that the website Seeking Arrangement wasn't mentioned at all, as that is the suspicion of how she met the guy. She was heavily involved in the sugar baby/daddy lifestyle from everything I've heard, even though she was raised Mormon. Also, the other podcast mentioned a mattress that a-hole got rid of that had blood stains on it.

  • Josh

    Josh NC

    Actually that phrase caught me up for a different reason. I do feel like at times there is a tendency in the true crime community and kk this podcast to lionize victims in wya that are not always helpful to solving the crimes. So virtue is ascribes to people with little context or reason and family statements are taken at face value. I particularly notice nick who seems like a very kind hearted fellow sometimes just throwing in a pretty heartfelt x person was good dude/girl, when it doesn’t seem he has much evidence to state it with that level of earnestness and at times I feel like it misrepresents what is going on. Sometimes victims of crimes are great people. And a lot of the times they can also be pretty troubled people or even downright bad propel themselves. Anyway I didn’t find the comment sexist, but it did seem kind of misplaced to me.

    Actually that phrase caught me up for a different reason. I do feel like at times there is a tendency in the true crime community and kk this podcast to lionize victims in wya that are not always helpful to solving the crimes. So virtue is ascribes to people with little context or reason and family statements are taken at face value. I particularly notice nick who seems like a very kind hearted fellow sometimes just throwing in a pretty heartfelt x person was good dude/girl, when it doesn’t seem he has much evidence to state it with that level of earnestness and at times I feel like it misrepresents what is going on. Sometimes victims of crimes are great people. And a lot of the times they can also be pretty troubled people or even downright bad propel themselves.

    Anyway I didn’t find the comment sexist, but it did seem kind of misplaced to me.

  • Jago

    Jago Hungary

    Hey Amy, you are an asshole. Why don't you find something useful in life and stop bitching about stuff that absolutely no sane person gives a shit about? I am so fed up with people like you. Stop being useless and destructive please.

    Hey Amy, you are an asshole. Why don't you find something useful in life and stop bitching about stuff that absolutely no sane person gives a shit about? I am so fed up with people like you. Stop being useless and destructive please.

  • mG

    mG

    Alison, I am pretty revolted by your post. You make sure to point out that you are not "victim blaming," then you go about victim blaming. No woman has ever done anything that necessitated her murder at the hands of a psychopath or any other person. The fault lies with those that choose to take lives. By your argument, all of the prostitutes of the Green River Killer kind of deserved what they got, because the of the occupation or lifestyle they chose. But the actual serial killer was kind of secondary. Please, shut up!

    Alison, I am pretty revolted by your post. You make sure to point out that you are not "victim blaming," then you go about victim blaming. No woman has ever done anything that necessitated her murder at the hands of a psychopath or any other person. The fault lies with those that choose to take lives. By your argument, all of the prostitutes of the Green River Killer kind of deserved what they got, because the of the occupation or lifestyle they chose. But the actual serial killer was kind of secondary. Please, shut up!

  • Nicole

    Nicole Brentwood TN

    I’m 52 years old and when people call me a girl, I take it as a compliment

    I’m 52 years old and when people call me a girl, I take it as a compliment

  • Matt S.

    Matt S. Pennsylvania

    Mark G. She isn't victim blaming at all. She is simply stating that if we ignore the fact that she met this man because there were arrangements for him to be a sugar daddy to her (which we don't know for sure) then we are not telling the whole story. These sugar daddies have serious issues that they have to pay for women and you have no idea how volatile one of them could be since they think they now "own" these women. No, Ms. Lueck did not deserve to die. She didn't deserve to be punished for her lifestyle. However, we cannot ignore that if women engage in this lifestyle they are putting themselves at risk. Its a warning to others, not a way to blame the victim.

    Mark G. She isn't victim blaming at all. She is simply stating that if we ignore the fact that she met this man because there were arrangements for him to be a sugar daddy to her (which we don't know for sure) then we are not telling the whole story. These sugar daddies have serious issues that they have to pay for women and you have no idea how volatile one of them could be since they think they now "own" these women. No, Ms. Lueck did not deserve to die. She didn't deserve to be punished for her lifestyle. However, we cannot ignore that if women engage in this lifestyle they are putting themselves at risk. Its a warning to others, not a way to blame the victim.

  • mG

    mG

    Hey Josh, I can list a thousand murders where the victims were blamed by their killers for one various reason or another. The reasons are inane and nonsensical, a rationalization by a diseased mind. You can encounter an unknown killer in a million different situations and your death will be solely their fault. Whenever I hear someone spout such puritanical nonsense, it pisses me off.

    Hey Josh, I can list a thousand murders where the victims were blamed by their killers for one various reason or another. The reasons are inane and nonsensical, a rationalization by a diseased mind. You can encounter an unknown killer in a million different situations and your death will be solely their fault. Whenever I hear someone spout such puritanical nonsense, it pisses me off.

  • RACHEL

    RACHEL O-H-I-O

    "She shouldn't have been wearing a low cut top and a mini skirt if she didn't want to be raped. It's clearly her fault. The guy was just doing what guys do and he responded to her inappropriate dress." THAT is victim blaming. Stating that someone who lives their life seeking relationships with strangers for the purpose of financial gain is placing themselves at a higher risk of being victimized is NOT victim blaming. It is on par with saying "Someone who drives their car fast on a crowded highway is more likely to be in an accident than people who stay in bed that day." We all get it.......you are super nice, righteous, sensitive people. That's awesome. Keep that ish up. But maybe just apply a little logic to your arguments before you start pointing fingers at folks like Allison :)

    "She shouldn't have been wearing a low cut top and a mini skirt if she didn't want to be raped. It's clearly her fault. The guy was just doing what guys do and he responded to her inappropriate dress." THAT is victim blaming. Stating that someone who lives their life seeking relationships with strangers for the purpose of financial gain is placing themselves at a higher risk of being victimized is NOT victim blaming. It is on par with saying "Someone who drives their car fast on a crowded highway is more likely to be in an accident than people who stay in bed that day." We all get it.......you are super nice, righteous, sensitive people. That's awesome. Keep that ish up. But maybe just apply a little logic to your arguments before you start pointing fingers at folks like Allison smile

  • Nicholas

    Nicholas Missouri

    One of the primary definitions of "girl" in the Webster's Dictionary is "A young woman". That is certainly an apt description of McKenzie. Frankly, I can't really think of a male podcaster that I think is less likely to be "sexist" than Nic. As a solution, I would recommend more beer and less over-sensitivity.

    One of the primary definitions of "girl" in the Webster's Dictionary is "A young woman". That is certainly an apt description of McKenzie. Frankly, I can't really think of a male podcaster that I think is less likely to be "sexist" than Nic. As a solution, I would recommend more beer and less over-sensitivity.

  • Amanda

    Amanda Maryland

    What an incredibly sad story. And yet I still managed to get a laugh from Nic's impression of wine making noise... "Hey, he's drinking us!" lol. Amy Adams- I'm 32 and I will often refer to other women close to my age as "girls." I can't help it... "woman" just ends up sounding a bit old to me. And college-age people are still kids in some ways. If you asked me if I think I was an adult in college, I would say that maybe I was legally an adult, but in many ways I still felt like a teenager. One time in my 20s, a little kid almost bumped into me at the mall, and their dad said "Watch out for the lady." And that made me feel weird, hearing me referred to as a "lady." lol. Nic- feel free to blog your thoughts on the Jack the Ripper case! I'm fascinated by it too. I have a really neat book about it that gave me a lot of think about... How many victims were there? What was the motive? How would it have gone differently if they had access to today's forensic technology? I've even heard a theory that there was no Jack the Ripper... that it was just a random string of murders that made a more fascinating story when you linked them together as the work of a serial killer.

    What an incredibly sad story. And yet I still managed to get a laugh from Nic's impression of wine making noise... "Hey, he's drinking us!" lol.

    Amy Adams- I'm 32 and I will often refer to other women close to my age as "girls." I can't help it... "woman" just ends up sounding a bit old to me. And college-age people are still kids in some ways. If you asked me if I think I was an adult in college, I would say that maybe I was legally an adult, but in many ways I still felt like a teenager. One time in my 20s, a little kid almost bumped into me at the mall, and their dad said "Watch out for the lady." And that made me feel weird, hearing me referred to as a "lady." lol.

    Nic- feel free to blog your thoughts on the Jack the Ripper case! I'm fascinated by it too. I have a really neat book about it that gave me a lot of think about... How many victims were there? What was the motive? How would it have gone differently if they had access to today's forensic technology? I've even heard a theory that there was no Jack the Ripper... that it was just a random string of murders that made a more fascinating story when you linked them together as the work of a serial killer.

  • joe

    joe dirt

    man, lots of triggering on this case good god. I never knew this girl was a "sugar baby". Learned something new. Was the talk of the town in the main stream until here recently. This must be some new hip term I've never heard of. Sounds similar to an escort. No people, the people above saying the lifestyle is a high risk lifestyle are not saying the girl deserved what she got. They are simply saying if u go out of your way to live an abnormal and possibly high risk lifestyle, the repercussions could be greater than someone who does not. Same as playing a sport I love, football. NFL players have a much higher risk at developing CTE/joint ligament issues than your average 9-5 or techie. Part of the game.

    man, lots of triggering on this case good god. I never knew this girl was a "sugar baby". Learned something new. Was the talk of the town in the main stream until here recently. This must be some new hip term I've never heard of. Sounds similar to an escort.

    No people, the people above saying the lifestyle is a high risk lifestyle are not saying the girl deserved what she got. They are simply saying if u go out of your way to live an abnormal and possibly high risk lifestyle, the repercussions could be greater than someone who does not. Same as playing a sport I love, football. NFL players have a much higher risk at developing CTE/joint ligament issues than your average 9-5 or techie. Part of the game.

  • Carlos Lam

    Carlos Lam

    There is a line between "victim blaming" and merely observing that some behaviors expose a person to greater risk than others. Perhaps pointing out those behaviors makes some people uncomfortable, but such discomfort shouldn't be justification for chastising others; doing so leads to self-censorship out of fear of social disapproval. Moreover, it's perfectly legitimate to point out that some behaviors are riskier than others without implying that the victim is "at fault" for the crime that befell him/her. IMHO, those who believe that doing this is "victim blaming" seem to be confusing correlation versus causation. For example, a victim who was involved in cooking & distributing methamphetamine is at a heightened risk of danger due to the chemicals used & people s/he associates with. A meth cooker who is murdered by an associate is not "at fault" for his/her murder by any means: the meth cooking itself didn't "murder" the victim. However, placing oneself in the meth-cooking world certainly increases the risk that something bad might occur: a correlation exists between the murder and the meth cooking.

    There is a line between "victim blaming" and merely observing that some behaviors expose a person to greater risk than others. Perhaps pointing out those behaviors makes some people uncomfortable, but such discomfort shouldn't be justification for chastising others; doing so leads to self-censorship out of fear of social disapproval. Moreover, it's perfectly legitimate to point out that some behaviors are riskier than others without implying that the victim is "at fault" for the crime that befell him/her. IMHO, those who believe that doing this is "victim blaming" seem to be confusing correlation versus causation.

    For example, a victim who was involved in cooking & distributing methamphetamine is at a heightened risk of danger due to the chemicals used & people s/he associates with. A meth cooker who is murdered by an associate is not "at fault" for his/her murder by any means: the meth cooking itself didn't "murder" the victim. However, placing oneself in the meth-cooking world certainly increases the risk that something bad might occur: a correlation exists between the murder and the meth cooking.

  • Ty

    Ty Jackson

    Preach on, Joe and Carlos! If you never set foot inside a bank, your risk of being killed in a bank robbery is considerably less than that of a person who works in a bank, mainly because they're in a bank every working day, and you are never in a bank. Is it the bank employee's "fault"? Did they "deserve" it? No. You should have a reasonable expectation of being able to work in a bank without being killed by a stranger. Nevertheless, I notice the bank has bulletproof glass, silent alarms, armed guards, and all kinds of other safety precautions. So there's what people "deserve" and then there's what behaviors are not wise and then there's what behaviors are downright reckless. And anyone who tries to accumulate "woke points" by saying those correlations don't exist isn't helping anyone but himself. You certainly aren't helping people like the next Ms. Lueck stay alive. Ask yourself why that's not more important to you.

    Preach on, Joe and Carlos! If you never set foot inside a bank, your risk of being killed in a bank robbery is considerably less than that of a person who works in a bank, mainly because they're in a bank every working day, and you are never in a bank. Is it the bank employee's "fault"? Did they "deserve" it? No. You should have a reasonable expectation of being able to work in a bank without being killed by a stranger. Nevertheless, I notice the bank has bulletproof glass, silent alarms, armed guards, and all kinds of other safety precautions. So there's what people "deserve" and then there's what behaviors are not wise and then there's what behaviors are downright reckless. And anyone who tries to accumulate "woke points" by saying those correlations don't exist isn't helping anyone but himself. You certainly aren't helping people like the next Ms. Lueck stay alive. Ask yourself why that's not more important to you.

  • Pop a top

    Pop a top Colorado

    Alison, I agree with your comment and mG I disagree with yours. Statistically, there are lifestyles that are considered high risk for violence and death. Police departments continually warn people that if you are hanging out with others who break the law, your risk of being harmed or killed is greater then if you refrained from that. mG, I didn't take Alisons post as saying victims deserve what they get, they don't. Your statement stated that these victims should be able to participate in their risky lifestyle without being murdered...yes in a perfect world they should. Realistically though, there are evil people in all chosen lifestyles, more so in illegal activities. Why put yourself at risk, it's certainly not worth it. She could have been murdered at her book club meeting or her knitting group, but she wasn't. She was murdered while meeting with a man in the night at a park. Her lifestyle put her at risk, it's that simple.

    Alison, I agree with your comment and mG I disagree with yours. Statistically, there are lifestyles that are considered high risk for violence and death. Police departments continually warn people that if you are hanging out with others who break the law, your risk of being harmed or killed is greater then if you refrained from that. mG, I didn't take Alisons post as saying victims deserve what they get, they don't. Your statement stated that these victims should be able to participate in their risky lifestyle without being murdered...yes in a perfect world they should. Realistically though, there are evil people in all chosen lifestyles, more so in illegal activities. Why put yourself at risk, it's certainly not worth it. She could have been murdered at her book club meeting or her knitting group, but she wasn't. She was murdered while meeting with a man in the night at a park. Her lifestyle put her at risk, it's that simple.

  • Liz Reighard

    Liz Reighard Salt Lake City

    We have gotten quite a bit of media coverage of this case due to our proximity to the crime. From all we are hearing here, she was indeed a "Sugar Baby". Being a Sugar Baby in Utah probably carries about the same risk as being an explosive's ordinance expert in a war zone. We have quite a bit of sex crime in Utah due to the predominant culture here. I could go on for hours about the reasons behind a lot of the deviancy, but, suffice it to say there are a lot of sexually confused folk here in "Zion". The whole "secret room for alcohol" doesn't sound out of the ordinary here, the hooks.....not so much. I don't like the idea of victim blaming, nobody would set out with the aspiration of getting brutally murdered, however, having said that, when you add a sketchy profession to a sketchy neighborhood at a sketchy time of night to a sexually sketchy population, the odds are in no way in your favor. I feel very sorry for her family, what a horrible way to lose a child. Nic, I am 53, and still refer to myself as a girl sometimes, it's genetically what I am, no big whoop. I've seen the "Woke" world, I much prefer my sleepy one. I love you guys, I listen to both of your shows all the time at work, thanks for putting in all the time and effort to keep us informed.

    We have gotten quite a bit of media coverage of this case due to our proximity to the crime. From all we are hearing here, she was indeed a "Sugar Baby". Being a Sugar Baby in Utah probably carries about the same risk as being an explosive's ordinance expert in a war zone. We have quite a bit of sex crime in Utah due to the predominant culture here. I could go on for hours about the reasons behind a lot of the deviancy, but, suffice it to say there are a lot of sexually confused folk here in "Zion". The whole "secret room for alcohol" doesn't sound out of the ordinary here, the hooks.....not so much. I don't like the idea of victim blaming, nobody would set out with the aspiration of getting brutally murdered, however, having said that, when you add a sketchy profession to a sketchy neighborhood at a sketchy time of night to a sexually sketchy population, the odds are in no way in your favor. I feel very sorry for her family, what a horrible way to lose a child. Nic, I am 53, and still refer to myself as a girl sometimes, it's genetically what I am, no big whoop. I've seen the "Woke" world, I much prefer my sleepy one. I love you guys, I listen to both of your shows all the time at work, thanks for putting in all the time and effort to keep us informed.

  • Stacey

    Stacey Salt Lake City

    Hi Nick and Captain! Absolutely love the Pod Cast, you both do a great job. BTW, I have been an adult for quite a while now, I refer to myself and my female friends as girls. I take no offense to that at all. I also wanted to let you guys know that the way the police discovered Kenzie's body was his phone GPS. After reaching the mountains in Logan where the GPS indicated he stopped, the police spread out to search and found some soil that had recently been disturbed. Upon digging the disturbed soil, they discover her body. Regarding the sugar baby/daddy lifestyle, apparently this has been verified, sadly. Personally, I know next to nothing about this lifestyle, nor would I pass judgement on anyone that choses to participate in it. It has been suggested that she chose the park because it was a public place with security cameras, and this should have given her some sort security. However, none of them were working and it was the middle of the night. I wish she had chosen an all night convenience store or 7-11. I am sickened that his sad excuse for a human being could even think of doing this to anyone! I truly hope that he never sees the outside world ever again! Keep up the good work!

    Hi Nick and Captain! Absolutely love the Pod Cast, you both do a great job. BTW, I have been an adult for quite a while now, I refer to myself and my female friends as girls. I take no offense to that at all. I also wanted to let you guys know that the way the police discovered Kenzie's body was his phone GPS. After reaching the mountains in Logan where the GPS indicated he stopped, the police spread out to search and found some soil that had recently been disturbed. Upon digging the disturbed soil, they discover her body.
    Regarding the sugar baby/daddy lifestyle, apparently this has been verified, sadly. Personally, I know next to nothing about this lifestyle, nor would I pass judgement on anyone that choses to participate in it. It has been suggested that she chose the park because it was a public place with security cameras, and this should have given her some sort security. However, none of them were working and it was the middle of the night. I wish she had chosen an all night convenience store or 7-11.
    I am sickened that his sad excuse for a human being could even think of doing this to anyone! I truly hope that he never sees the outside world ever again!
    Keep up the good work!

  • True Crime Garage

    True Crime Garage

    Thank you Stacey! Nic

    Thank you Stacey!
    Nic

  • Amy Adams

    Amy Adams Global

    @Amanda I'm older than you and my girlfriends and I still call each other girls. it's one thing when women call other women girls vs. men calling them girls. I know it's a double standard but we get to do that and men don't. Your story reminded me of the first time I was called a lady too LOL I was only 20 years old. The person who said that was probably 2 or 3 years younger than me. :-)

    @Amanda I'm older than you and my girlfriends and I still call each other girls. it's one thing when women call other women girls vs. men calling them girls. I know it's a double standard but we get to do that and men don't. Your story reminded me of the first time I was called a lady too LOL I was only 20 years old. The person who said that was probably 2 or 3 years younger than me. :-)

  • Aspen

    Aspen NH

    It's ridiculous that people are even arguing about victim shaming and what constitutes it. Of course it's victim shaming to point out that her "lifestyle was risky wahhhhh"...get off your ridiculous soap box, bitter old ladies. We can do whatever the f we want, and it doesn't make it our fault that some sicko decided to kidnap her. The poor girl thought the fake cameras in the park were real. The only good thing about this case is that it's resulting in that park getting real cameras to substitute the dummy cameras.

    It's ridiculous that people are even arguing about victim shaming and what constitutes it. Of course it's victim shaming to point out that her "lifestyle was risky wahhhhh"...get off your ridiculous soap box, bitter old ladies. We can do whatever the f we want, and it doesn't make it our fault that some sicko decided to kidnap her. The poor girl thought the fake cameras in the park were real. The only good thing about this case is that it's resulting in that park getting real cameras to substitute the dummy cameras.

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