Monster of Florence /// 124 /// 125

14 comments

  • Megs

    Megs

    So I have one problem with the 1968 murder--the woman with multiple lovers. If you and your spouse have an open marriage agreement, and you don't have to hide it, why the heck are you still taking your young son out on your trysts???? That seems very, very, very strange to me. Not that it likely relates to anything, but as I was listening to the episode that was one point I kept tripping over. Why was the kid there in the first place?

    So I have one problem with the 1968 murder--the woman with multiple lovers. If you and your spouse have an open marriage agreement, and you don't have to hide it, why the heck are you still taking your young son out on your trysts???? That seems very, very, very strange to me. Not that it likely relates to anything, but as I was listening to the episode that was one point I kept tripping over. Why was the kid there in the first place?

  • JT

    JT 54217

    I ABSOLUTELY love & support your podcast in any way that I can: since day 1. I hv to say, though your "1 & only" fan page has become nothing that I love about your efforts. I had to block them for not ONLY LACK of upholding your standards but also for harrassing for saying so... I hope that you all do not support the direction that page is going...much RESPECT for your sympathetic take on each & every episode. #♡TCGALWAYS

    I ABSOLUTELY love & support your podcast in any way that I can: since day 1. I hv to say, though your "1 & only" fan page has become nothing that I love about your efforts. I had to block them for not ONLY LACK of upholding your standards but also for harrassing for saying so... I hope that you all do not support the direction that page is going...much RESPECT for your sympathetic take on each & every episode. #♡TCGALWAYS

  • Avanti

    Avanti Austin

    Please cover Stevie Bates. A lot of people are still worried about her and want to know what happened to her.

    Please cover Stevie Bates. A lot of people are still worried about her and want to know what happened to her.

  • jessica L

    jessica L st louis

    Has anyone traced where Dr George hodel was at the time these happened? the Black Dahlia suspect?

    Has anyone traced where Dr George hodel was at the time these happened? the Black Dahlia suspect?

  • True Crime Garage

    True Crime Garage

    Hi Meg, as the story goes the boy's father was at home sick. The boy had knowledge of his mothers lovers but h may have only knew them as family friends. Supposedly he would call them uncle. The boy woke up and then saw his dead mother. As a man he has refused to discuss this and claims to have no memory of anything other than seeing his dead mother. The 68 murders may be the most troubling to this case. Thanks, Nic

    Hi Meg, as the story goes the boy's father was at home sick. The boy had knowledge of his mothers lovers but h may have only knew them as family friends. Supposedly he would call them uncle. The boy woke up and then saw his dead mother. As a man he has refused to discuss this and claims to have no memory of anything other than seeing his dead mother.
    The 68 murders may be the most troubling to this case.
    Thanks,
    Nic

  • True Crime Garage

    True Crime Garage

    JT I won't apologize for someone else. I truly don't know much about our "fan page" some guy runs it. So it's in every sense of the word a fan page. It's operated by a fan and fans view and contribute to the page. I like this forum here and chatting with you all - about the cases. If they didn't make you feel welcome at the fan page, well that sucks and that is on them, not you & not me. You are most certainly welcome to join me here anytime. Cheers! Nic

    JT I won't apologize for someone else. I truly don't know much about our "fan page" some guy runs it. So it's in every sense of the word a fan page. It's operated by a fan and fans view and contribute to the page. I like this forum here and chatting with you all - about the cases. If they didn't make you feel welcome at the fan page, well that sucks and that is on them, not you & not me. You are most certainly welcome to join me here anytime.
    Cheers!
    Nic

  • True Crime Garage

    True Crime Garage

    Jess - that is an interesting thought. I'm sure his son would tell you he was in the hills of Florence. I'm thinking what, 68-83? Sorry fully researched 2 other cases since. May be too long of a time period unless he was returning from time to time. He would have had to have a safe secure place to hide the gun. I find this unlikely. Plus from according to Steve Hodel, George was committing the zodiac murders from 68-70. Cheers, Nic

    Jess - that is an interesting thought. I'm sure his son would tell you he was in the hills of Florence. I'm thinking what, 68-83? Sorry fully researched 2 other cases since. May be too long of a time period unless he was returning from time to time. He would have had to have a safe secure place to hide the gun. I find this unlikely. Plus from according to Steve Hodel, George was committing the zodiac murders from 68-70.
    Cheers,
    Nic

  • Lauren K.

    Lauren K.

    Dear Nic l and The Captain, So, by no means am I an avid armchair detective, HOWEVER I have been gorging myself with every single one of y'all's podcasts for the past three months. I jump around, but I am currently on the monster of Florence. I have a theory, and I'm curious if anyone else has this same feeling: The main "suspect" (I put in quotations because he was never named as a suspect) that stands out to me is actually Natalino Mele. Yeah, the son of Barbara Locci from the first killing in 1968. I googled his name, but could not find any specific details about his life. What really stood out to me was his reaction to his mother's death. He found a nearby home, and when the occupants answered he casually said he was tired and mentioned that his mother and uncle were dead in a car? At 6 years old, he should understand just how serious and upsetting that would be... However, according to the report, it did not phase him. His father was convicted of this murder, and allegedly threw the gun during his escape from the scene. I believe it is possible that Natalino Mele could have seen where he threw the gun, and collected it for himself. I understand that this would make him 12 years old at the time of the next murder. How large would he have been as a twelve years old? Some twelve year olds look much older. Was he showing any signs of psychopathic or sociopathic tendencies? He has motive for the rituals performed during the murders as well. He could have resentment towards his father for killing his mother, or potentially not being man enough to be sufficient for his mother. He could loathe his mother for sleeping with another man that she called his uncle while he was in the back seat of the car. This could easily cause him to be disgusted with women and their sexual organs. It could be him taking away a woman's ability to be intimate or to cheat on their significant other. I am curious if you two, or anyone else, has thought of this connection and may know more about Natalino Mele. Was he incarcerated for unrelated crimes, or living in other areas during the dormancies? Was he living after 1985? Thank you for your time, I know it's a long message! I really enjoy y'all's podcast and cannot wait for the future true crimes you guys will cover. P.S. Captain, I totally caught your penis joke in part 2 of the monster of Florence.

    Dear Nic l and The Captain,

    So, by no means am I an avid armchair detective, HOWEVER I have been gorging myself with every single one of y'all's podcasts for the past three months. I jump around, but I am currently on the monster of Florence. I have a theory, and I'm curious if anyone else has this same feeling:
    The main "suspect" (I put in quotations because he was never named as a suspect) that stands out to me is actually Natalino Mele. Yeah, the son of Barbara Locci from the first killing in 1968. I googled his name, but could not find any specific details about his life.
    What really stood out to me was his reaction to his mother's death. He found a nearby home, and when the occupants answered he casually said he was tired and mentioned that his mother and uncle were dead in a car? At 6 years old, he should understand just how serious and upsetting that would be...
    However, according to the report, it did not phase him. His father was convicted of this murder, and allegedly threw the gun during his escape from the scene. I believe it is possible that Natalino Mele could have seen where he threw the gun, and collected it for himself.
    I understand that this would make him 12 years old at the time of the next murder.
    How large would he have been as a twelve years old? Some twelve year olds look much older. Was he showing any signs of psychopathic or sociopathic tendencies?
    He has motive for the rituals performed during the murders as well. He could have resentment towards his father for killing his mother, or potentially not being man enough to be sufficient for his mother. He could loathe his mother for sleeping with another man that she called his uncle while he was in the back seat of the car. This could easily cause him to be disgusted with women and their sexual organs.
    It could be him taking away a woman's ability to be intimate or to cheat on their significant other.

    I am curious if you two, or anyone else, has thought of this connection and may know more about Natalino Mele. Was he incarcerated for unrelated crimes, or living in other areas during the dormancies? Was he living after 1985?

    Thank you for your time, I know it's a long message! I really enjoy y'all's podcast and cannot wait for the future true crimes you guys will cover.

    P.S. Captain, I totally caught your penis joke in part 2 of the monster of Florence.

  • True Crime Garage

    True Crime Garage

    Lauren, There are a few good books out there regarding this case each with the own theories. I recommend that you pick up - The Monster of Florence, a true story Douglas Preston and Mario Spezi. It's been a while since I have read it but if I remember correctly this book shares your theory and describes exactly how this went down. Must of it involves the unreported theft of the original murder weapon. Good theory, get the book and dive into it more. Cheers, Nic

    Lauren,
    There are a few good books out there regarding this case each with the own theories. I recommend that you pick up - The Monster of Florence, a true story Douglas Preston and Mario Spezi. It's been a while since I have read it but if I remember correctly this book shares your theory and describes exactly how this went down. Must of it involves the unreported theft of the original murder weapon. Good theory, get the book and dive into it more.
    Cheers,
    Nic

  • Sarah

    Sarah North Carolina

    What if it was a cop?! It would explain how so much evidence went missing or wasn’t stored appropriately. They would also have access to send in letters to the right people and plant bullets in people yards.

    What if it was a cop?! It would explain how so much evidence went missing or wasn’t stored appropriately. They would also have access to send in letters to the right people and plant bullets in people yards.

  • Mad Hatter

    Mad Hatter Jacksonville FL

    I know there was gaps in the Zodiac killings could they correspond with the Florence monster killings. Similar MO couples an the letters plus what better way to not caught is to kill in 2 different countries an continents. Also just enough of a difference to fool the FBI. Just thought could be nothing or the solution An to paraphase Sherlock holmes this quite a 6 beer problem.

    I know there was gaps in the Zodiac killings could they correspond with the Florence monster killings. Similar MO couples an the letters plus what better way to not caught is to kill in 2 different countries an continents.
    Also just enough of a difference to fool the FBI.

    Just thought could be nothing or the solution
    An to paraphase Sherlock holmes this quite a 6 beer problem.

  • matt

    matt Amsterdam

    It is of today the release by italian magazine Tempi stating how Zodiac moved to Florence and carried on his MO while working and living in the USA military bases in tuscany. The article is long and very detailed. I include the link, in italian however https://www.tempi.it/il-mostro-di-firenze-e-zodiac#.Ww15SCMrK_E

    It is of today the release by italian magazine Tempi stating how Zodiac moved to Florence and carried on his MO while working and living
    in the USA military bases in tuscany. The article is long and very detailed. I include the link, in italian however https://www.tempi.it/il-mostro-di-firenze-e-zodiac#.Ww15SCMrK_E

  • Tracey

    Tracey U.K

    The act of watching couples having sex is known as 'dogging here in the U.K. There are specific areas where this is prevalent and has been going on since the 50s. There have been celebrities over the years who have been reported on who have been caught in these areas in various acts and nowadays there are websites which are dedicated to groups of these people who like to parttake in this behaviour.

    The act of watching couples having sex is known as 'dogging here in the U.K. There are specific areas where this is prevalent and has been going on since the 50s. There have been celebrities over the years who have been reported on who have been caught in these areas in various acts and nowadays there are websites which are dedicated to groups of these people who like to parttake in this behaviour.

  • James

    James TX

    Listening to old episodes, and wanted to comment on this one. I have never dug into this case before, and this episode is my first real summary of it, aside from occasionally seeing it mentioned on Reddit. This really seems to me like a much more simple case than what has been made of it. I honestly don't think that any of the people mentioned had any involvement with the murders whatsoever. The idea of the "clan killing" in 1968 is just nonsense to me. I don't see how the husband would have been involved at all (he was home sick right?) I know he confessed, but how many false confessions have we heard over the years? And we've seen how the Italian police push their theories, to the point of planting evidence. No doubt in my mind that they would extract a false confession, especially in 1968. I feel like all the other theories have to jump through all kinds of hoops to explain how all the murders are done with the same gun when the simplest explanation is that it's just one guy with that gun and he's never been caught. No burglaries, no finding the gun in the woods, no clan killings, no evidence modified in storage. Just one guy with a gun, and a bunch of police who are trying to close the case any way they can, but don't have leads to take them to the right person. I would love to know more about the murders in 1968. I feel like that is the key. We see with many serial killers that their first murder (assuming this is his first) is the one that they make mistakes on, before they've perfected the craft. We also have the boy, the victim's son. According to Wikipedia, he was asleep in the back seat when the murders happened. The gunfire, screaming, and glass shattering didn't wake him up? I think he must have seen the killer. There's no way it was his father. The father would have known that his son was in the car, and would have likely taken him home if he did the crime. It's ridiculous that he was ever prosecuted for the crime, and it's probably the reason that whoever did it got away and continued to kill later. I doubt this case will ever be solved as, like the Zodiac, the killer has probably already died from natural causes and taken his secrets with him, but I feel that all of these murders were completely random crimes done by a single psychopath with a compulsion to kill, and none of the names mentioned are that person.

    Listening to old episodes, and wanted to comment on this one. I have never dug into this case before, and this episode is my first real summary of it, aside from occasionally seeing it mentioned on Reddit.

    This really seems to me like a much more simple case than what has been made of it. I honestly don't think that any of the people mentioned had any involvement with the murders whatsoever. The idea of the "clan killing" in 1968 is just nonsense to me. I don't see how the husband would have been involved at all (he was home sick right?) I know he confessed, but how many false confessions have we heard over the years? And we've seen how the Italian police push their theories, to the point of planting evidence. No doubt in my mind that they would extract a false confession, especially in 1968.

    I feel like all the other theories have to jump through all kinds of hoops to explain how all the murders are done with the same gun when the simplest explanation is that it's just one guy with that gun and he's never been caught. No burglaries, no finding the gun in the woods, no clan killings, no evidence modified in storage. Just one guy with a gun, and a bunch of police who are trying to close the case any way they can, but don't have leads to take them to the right person.

    I would love to know more about the murders in 1968. I feel like that is the key. We see with many serial killers that their first murder (assuming this is his first) is the one that they make mistakes on, before they've perfected the craft. We also have the boy, the victim's son. According to Wikipedia, he was asleep in the back seat when the murders happened. The gunfire, screaming, and glass shattering didn't wake him up? I think he must have seen the killer. There's no way it was his father. The father would have known that his son was in the car, and would have likely taken him home if he did the crime. It's ridiculous that he was ever prosecuted for the crime, and it's probably the reason that whoever did it got away and continued to kill later.

    I doubt this case will ever be solved as, like the Zodiac, the killer has probably already died from natural causes and taken his secrets with him, but I feel that all of these murders were completely random crimes done by a single psychopath with a compulsion to kill, and none of the names mentioned are that person.

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